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Washington Women’s Heritage Project records, 1900-2000 
University of Washington Libraries Special Collections 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton 
May 16, 1994 
Cassette 5, Side 1 
 
 
Barbara Wright  00:02 
16th, 1993. This is May nine-- May 16, 1993 we're in the home of Olive Carlton, Olive-- 
interviewing Olive Carlton, and this is Barbara Wright. I thought we'd first start off by filling in 
some of the holes from last week, okay? Because one thing that I'm a little sketchy on is-- I was 
wondering if we could do, like, a brief, like, timeline. So you went to Cherbourg, and how long 
were you in Cherbourg for? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  00:39 
Yes, when we did those, it's hard just to say exactly how long-- it's been so long. The years in 
between '44 and '46 are-- it's really hard to say just exactly where we were, but-- let me see, I 
found pictures, I should have looked them up for you, that were dated when I was in Cherbourg. 
It would be though, '44. September, '44, and I-- we had Christmas there. So I would say maybe 
the end of December, or the beginning of '47, was either the end of December or around about 
the first of the new year would be the-- what, '40? No, '45. Excuse me. '45. And... Yeah, and then 
from '40-- say, from '45 is when we went to Deauville, France. Now I'm getting a little bit mixed 
up with-- from Deauville to Brussels. Here. We were in Brussels, '45. See, this is-- our mess 
sergeant made this up for us. That's where we had a merry Christmas in '45. So, we were there 
December. So that would be about a year. I'll get that-- yeah, that's sounds about right. No, wait a 
minute, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. What did I say, '40? 
 
Barbara Wright  02:53 
So, December '45... 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  02:57 
'40-- no, December '44 to-- well, we had to be done before December '45 from Deauville, so in 
between that we were in Deauville and then we were in Brussels, I'd say maybe about November 
'45. I could be wrong, I could be way out. 
 
Barbara Wright  03:26 
I'll just put just November-December. 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  03:27 
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Yeah, because I really don't know. That was in Brussels. Then we went from Brussels to 
Germany, Frankfurt, Germany, and that would be... Now, you see, I thought we had December in 
Germany. I guess not. So it'd be from-- well, we left soon after this, Brussels, and went to 
Germany, and we'd be-- and I was there until '46, and I came home November '46. I know that's 
not very clear, but that's the best I can do on that. So that was VE Day. Oh, that was the first 
anniversary of VE Day.  
 
Barbara Wright  04:29 
Okay, and what is VE Day? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  04:33 
So I-- That's when the war finished. 
 
Barbara Wright  04:36 
Okay. What does VE stand for? Victory... 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  04:38 
Victory, European victory. And the other one was Japanese-- VJ Day was victory with Japanese. 
Oh, here you are. See there's another one, we so we were in Brussels in July, '45 too. So you see, 
I'm not clear how long we stayed in these places. I'm really not, but those are kind of what I was 
going by. And then we were-- this is in Germany, Baumgarten. This is where I used to help the 
Red Cross a lot. And this was the building that we-- that they had there. Okay, this where I did 
all the singing and dancing, there was dancing. We had all kinds of-- the Red Cross put this on 
for us, but that's the Baumgarten. 
 
Barbara Wright  05:35 
Now, did you do that in the ballroom or in the snack bar, or... 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  05:39 
This is what-- this was our-- where we ate. They had, like, snack bar and whatever they could 
get. And this is the ballroom, yeah, this is where we danced. 
 
Barbara Wright  05:54 
And was [inaudible]-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  05:55 
And that stage would be this end, because that's the entrance, I'm sure. So the stage would be 
here. 
 
Barbara Wright  06:01 
Opposite end, then, of the floor.  
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  06:02 
And then this-- well, it used to be a conservatory, but of course, it wasn't when we were there, 
but that's what that used to be. And then this is what they had set up. So you'd go in, you'd-- 
 
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Barbara Wright  06:18 
Oh, so the-- like, this little leaflet was actually put out by the military then?  
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  06:22 
Yeah, the Red Cross, and see, there's our... Dancing, this is where I did a lot of jitterbug. And 
then they started having trophies, and I won a couple of trophies, yeah. I was good, jitterbug 
[laughs]. And then they had this lovely-- this was a lovely room, and they had a piano in there 
too. And sometimes I'd go-- and there was always people that could play the piano, like guitars 
or, you know, we just sing along and-- or sometimes, they used as a quiet room too. Like where 
they would write [inaudible] to your mom, address letters. This is the way I remember it. Oh, 
you see that? That's the conservatory. 
 
Barbara Wright  07:10 
Oh, that's gorgeous. And this was like, for instance, like-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  07:11 
Palm tree. 
 
Barbara Wright  07:11 
Yeah, the palm trees and all were intact, I guess? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  07:12 
Yeah. 
 
Barbara Wright  07:12 
So Brussels was like-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  07:13 
Yeah, they had it like that, exactly like this, just the way I remember. Because for some reason, 
the Germans didn't hit any part of this. Or, not the Germans, I mean, our people, you know, with 
the bombs, didn't-- wasn't the Germans. We didn't hit anything. This was all kind of really good. 
And our headquarters was-- hadn't been touched either, the [?Faben?] Building, it was called. 
Let's see if there's more. 
 
Barbara Wright  07:53 
What's this column here? Remember that? Kind of hard to tell what that is. It looks like-- oh, it 
looks like-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  07:59 
They had a lot of art stuff in these things.  
 
Barbara Wright  08:04 
Definitely want to make a picture of that next week. 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  08:11 
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My pictures are so small, that's what the other people said. They were so small, they didn't think 
they'd come out. Maybe you can do it. I found it-- I got my old footlocker out, I got-- come 
across all this. 
 
Barbara Wright  08:27 
What was that like, going through your footlocker? Do you bring back a lot of old memories? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  08:31 
[Laughs] Yeah. And then I have-- this was a pass that I had to have a special one, because when 
we first got to Germany, our chaplain's office, they didn't have space for us in the Fabian 
Building, which was the real-- Ike's headquarters, and so they put us on the outside, the gates. So 
I had to have this special pass-- oh no, this is a meal ticket. I'm sorry, this is the pass. And I had 
to have a special pass, get in and out. And then this was our meal ticket. 
 
Barbara Wright  09:02 
And with the meal ticket, did you just-- so you had to present that every time you went to the 
mess line? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  09:18 
Every time I went through, yeah.  
 
Barbara Wright  09:20 
And when they put it--  
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  09:21 
They put it by that-- 
 
Barbara Wright  09:22 
Or just kind of looked at it? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  09:23 
Sometime, when we got there, some of them-- the man, were allowed to go off post and stay off 
post. You know, they could get their meals elsewhere. But this way, ours was all paid for. They 
were starting to do that when I had to leave. 
 
Barbara Wright  09:50 
So when-- how were you notified that you were going to be going from Deauville to Brussels? 
Like, what-- how much notice would they give you to pack up? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  09:57 
About 12 hours? 24 hours? Yeah, that's about it [laughs]. 
 
Barbara Wright  10:03 
What were goodbyes like? Or were there even-- were they even-- would it-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  10:08 
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No, you just packed up and go. They loaded us in trucks. A very interesting trips. Oh, we were 
sore for the time you got out those trucks. You didn't know if you'd sit down again or not. 
 
Barbara Wright  10:22 
Bumpy, I take it? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  10:23 
Yes, oh yeah, they were bad. 
 
Barbara Wright  10:25 
How long would these trips be? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  10:27 
[Whispers] Oh boy, I really don't know. Seemed like hours, and I honestly couldn't tell you. But I 
don't ever remember spending a night anywhere, so it had to be a day trip. 
 
Barbara Wright  10:49 
Do you-- did you ever like, wear a watch? While you were over there? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  10:53 
Oh, yeah.  
 
Barbara Wright  10:54 
The reason why I asked that is because, like, I know I'm-- for instance, some people don't wear a 
watch if they just don't want to think about how much time they spend doing a certain task. Now, 
you mentioned that you met Mrs. Roosevelt, where did you meet Mrs. Roosevelt? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  11:11 
In Frankfurt, Germany. She came to eat with us in the mess hall. 
 
Barbara Wright  11:15 
Oh, okay. And so, tell me about your meeting with her. 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  11:20 
Well, it wasn't-- I mean, like we're doing now-- just that she was there and she was talking to 
everybody. She could go around everybody and talk to them. I just shook her hands, and she has 
asked me questions of what I did, how long I'd been over there. I know she said, Well, don't you 
think it's time you went home? And it wasn't long after that until we were made come home. So I 
don't know if she had anything to do with that or not [laughs], but she was very interested, 
especially the women over there and the-- I know, one question, she asked all of us how we were 
being treated. 
 
Barbara Wright  12:02 
 And what was the answer?  
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  12:04 
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Oh, just fine. I never heard any-- oh, we've always got gripes. I mean, that's part of living, that's 
just part of what it is. If you don't gripe, there's something wrong. So we just took things as they 
came. Put up with it, because most of us had volunteered to be over there. We would, as I told 
you, our group was the only ones that kind of got the letter. But we could have got out of it if 
we'd wanted to. So nobody really complained, because if you didn't want to be there, you could-- 
well, you couldn't get out, but it was your own decision to join the service. You knew it was not 
going to be any picnic. I mean, wars are not picnics. 
 
Barbara Wright  12:59 
And also, too, wasn't because when I-- my generation, that being the 20-somethings, in what is 
this, 1993, you know, we hear-- we think of Vietnam, and of course, everything that happened 
over there. So we always hear negative-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  13:12 
Well, that was a different war altogether. 
 
Barbara Wright  13:14 
So the mentality then was really towards, this is something we're really doing for our country. 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  13:19 
You're doing it for your country, that's right. Vietnam wasn't completely like that, no. 
 
Barbara Wright  13:19 
Oh, because you had-- it sounds like you've got a, you know, obviously a very good experience 
with war. But during the Gulf War, how did-- there were some female POWs taken. How did 
you feel when you heard that? Did you feel any connection towards that, or were you-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  13:46 
Oh yes. Oh yeah. Because we didn't have any prisoners taken-- now, I shouldn't really say that, 
because I really didn't know. I haven't heard of any, let's put it that way. Now, the nurses did. 
The nurses got taken prisoners. But I didn't hear of any of our girls, so I don't know. 
 
Barbara Wright  14:11 
What were-- you mentioned the nurses, did you ever talk to any of the nurses that came in? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  14:16 
Well, I did. Now, you talk to any nurses nowadays? They didn't even know we were over there, 
but the ones I knew was because, as I told you, I was one of the fortunate ones, I guess you could 
say. I was able to go and mingle with the guys in the front line with the chaplains, and then I'd-- 
we'd go to the tents where the nurses had the injured. So I was able to talk to them, and then 
sometimes, if all the guys and-- gone, they let me eat with the nurses, so I was able to talk to a 
few. 
 
Barbara Wright  15:07 
What did you talk about?  
 
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Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  15:11 
Oh my, I don't remember. 
 
Barbara Wright  15:13 
Okay. 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  15:13 
I don't know that.  
 
Barbara Wright  15:13 
What did you-- did you know of like any-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  15:16 
Generally, we kept it in a very happy-- nothing going on with what was going on. Maybe they 
talk about families or, you know, something cheerful. That's one thing I always tried to do, 
especially myself, in the chaplains', keep the spirits going. 
 
Barbara Wright  15:39 
So there was never any talk of like-- or did you hear of any, for instance, like nurses having, like, 
any sort of shell shock, or? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  15:47 
Well, they didn't get that until they came home. 
 
Barbara Wright  15:49 
Alright. But have you heard-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  15:52 
You see, right now, some of them, at my age, it's coming through right now. 
 
Barbara Wright  15:58 
Really? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  15:58 
Mm-hmm. Takes a few years for that stress to really show itself. Now we've got... What did I 
hear? There's about two-- I belong to the Women's Overseas League too, all the women that were 
overseas, and most of them are nurses in the-- in our Tacoma unit, and they were talking not long 
ago that they were having problems with the nurses from Korea, that had been through Korea 
and saw the terrible destruction there. And I think they said World War Two, there was some 
[inaudible] in their older years, see, you'd get-- we'd be in our-- what, in our 70s [inaudible]. 
 
Barbara Wright  15:58 
How would one of you, from talking with your comrades, what has been through the 
manifestation of the shell shock nightmares, or? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  15:58 
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Yeah, nightmares. Nightmares, most likely. 
 
Barbara Wright  15:58 
How many-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  16:35 
All coming back to them for some reason. I guess when we get older, we tend to look back a lot, 
see like I'm doing now. And maybe they have-- they're people that can't handle that, I don't 
know. See, I can handle it. I saw some terrible things and-- but I'm able to handle it. Memories-- 
sometimes, as I said before, I think, Did I actually go through this, or is it just a dream? And then 
I look at something and I think, It was no dream. 
 
Barbara Wright  17:44 
You mentioned first, you said you've seen some horrible things, and you know, you mentioned 
the hospital ship. Is that the only horrible thing that you saw?  
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  17:51 
Oh no, no, I saw that before I even got into service. I mean, we had people burned to death in 
that bombing right on Belfast, and to smell the flesh, I mean-- you saw-- and then I used to go 
volunteering, you know, singing and cheering, trying to cheer people up. And I saw the masses 
that were burnt, their skin and all that kind of stuff. So I saw before ever got into the army. In 
fact, I think maybe I saw a little bit more than I did when I got in there, because that other thing, 
the hospital ship, that was only for a short time, but that was-- as some of those, I managed to-- 
but then, I had chaplains to help me too, to get over that. So it only took me about a week. I was 
fine, until the next day, all of us were fine. And then the next day, it hit us, what we'd gone 
through, what we'd seen, and then that's when we kind of-- I don't, I can't express the way I felt. I 
really can't, but some of the girls really had the shakes, and shivers, and the shock, anybody in 
shock. But as I said, I have the chaplains to help me.  
 
Barbara Wright  19:20 
How'd the chaplains help? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  19:21 
Talking, let me talk it out, because that helps. Some people may [inaudible], but for me, that 
helped, and they were very helpful. We prayed and we did, you know-- it all helps. So I got over 
it. But as I said, you see, now I can look back, and that doesn't bother me, but some of these 
nurses saw an awful lot for an awful long time, and that is bound to do some damage, and 
especially now when they're-- it comes back, as I said. 
 
Barbara Wright  19:58 
Like with some of the women in your, like, Tacoma WAC group, have you-- has there been any 
sort of persons, even though they may have shell shock now to, like, Stress Syndrome, whatever, 
have they had maybe-- can you see, maybe a history of, like, alcohol problems or marriages that 
ended, or? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  20:19 
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Mm-mm. 
 
Barbara Wright  20:19 
Okay, 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  20:24 
No-- oh, there were, but I don't-- vaguely [inaudible] know. 
 
Barbara Wright  20:33 
What about the Korean nurses? Anything? Is there any sort of, like, drinking patterns that you 
can see or broken marriages-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  20:42 
I didn't know, you see, I was out of it in Korea. I was married then, when the Korean War 
started. So I don't know anything about that part of it. 
 
Barbara Wright  20:53 
Okay, so then they been in your WAC group in Tacoma then, correct? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  20:57 
No. In fact, I don't believe there was very many of the WACs went over to Korea. I think it was 
mostly nurses, Red Cross.  
 
Barbara Wright  21:11 
Now, when you went to Brussels, what did you do in Brussels? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  21:16 
Same thing, chaplain's division, and we'd go out, and that's where I started looking for grave sites 
out in Saint-Lô, in France. We'd go there. And families were anxious to know where their loved 
ones were buried. So that's when I started going looking for the graves of these people. I think I 
did a part while I was in Deauville too, but then I did more of it from Brussels. That was a bit of 
traveling, totally. 
 
Barbara Wright  21:44 
So when you went out on these, you know, expeditions to Saint-Lô, would you just be gone for 
the day, or would you stay overnight? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  21:57 
No, we'd stay over-- there would be, generally, a camp close by, the, you know, military camps 
that I stayed in. 
 
Barbara Wright  22:01 
Alright. What would the accommodations be like when you went out in the field, as it were? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  22:11 
Just your tent. 
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Barbara Wright  22:12 
Tent and a cot or on the floor? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  22:14 
Yeah, no, well, sometimes it's just a floor, yeah, the floor. Unless that camp had them, and a lot 
of them did have the cots, so I didn't sleep on the ground too much. But if there was a cot, that-- I 
got that. 
 
Barbara Wright  22:29 
It sounds like you had some more free time in Brussels, is that true? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  22:36 
Uh-huh, yeah. We had a lot more free time. Yeah, yeah.  
 
Barbara Wright  22:38 
Why do you think that was? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  22:40 
Because we didn't-- there wasn't that much going on then, you know, it's the fighting that stopped 
by then, yeah. Well, it had kind of eased off anyway, but... Yeah. I didn't have too much to do. I 
didn't even have to go to the field when we got to Brussels. 
 
Barbara Wright  23:09 
What would be a typical day like for you in Brussels? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  23:13 
Go to the office, and it was mostly paperwork. Typing, writing letters, as I said, to families, and 
that was my job to check them over, and either I answer them myself, or the chaplain would 
answer, it all depended what it was about. But I was mostly the typist, and then I also was 
receptionist, and we had a lot of visitors come in at that time, so I'd have to be prepared for that. 
 
Barbara Wright  23:45 
How would you prepare for visitors? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  23:52 
Just to clean up the office, that's about it. 
 
Barbara Wright  23:54 
Okay. You mentioned that you saw Eisenhower, so-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  24:00 
Oh yeah, we went to his headquarters when we went to Germany, Frankfurt. Then we joined his 
headquarters. 
 
Barbara Wright  24:06 
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I see, okay. And once again, when you went to Frankfurt, was it just pretty much 12 hours 
notice, and then? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  24:14 
Mm-hmm. 
 
Barbara Wright  24:15 
Okay, then once -- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  24:16 
Told to get your duffel bags filled and your stuff together and get on the truck. 
 
Barbara Wright  24:23 
And once again, there weren't any sort of, you know, heartfelt goodbyes, or just kind of-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  24:28 
The only time-- when we were in Brussels was the time-- yeah, the war was over, that they were 
letting some of the guys go home-- and the girls go home and they had to have points. That 
meant they had to have so many months overseas, over there, and the type of job you got, so you 
had-- how they did, I don't know, but they had points to do. And if you had a certain amount of 
points. You could go home. Well, that is where I finally said goodbye to my dear friend. She was 
like a sister to me. She looked after me the whole time we was in-- we were over there.  
 
Barbara Wright  25:14 
And this was? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  25:14 
And this was in '45. 
 
Barbara Wright  25:16 
Okay, what her name was? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  25:17 
Jean Falconer. 
 
Barbara Wright  25:17 
Okay, how does Jean spell her last name? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  25:24 
F-A-L-C-O-N-E-R, but it is now Slater, S-L-A-T-E-R. Jean Falconer [inaudible]. That's the 
name she had then, and now, I know her as Slater. She lives in Oregon. She's not too good either. 
Afraid we're gonna lose her pretty soon, but that is when that was the hardest time of saying 
goodbye to anybody. The others, I kind of-- well, I knew they wanted to go home, but Jean, I just 
hated seeing her go. She's like a sister. We've kept up corresponding ever since. 
 
Barbara Wright  26:03 
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How often do you correspond?  
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  26:05 
Oh, three or four times a year. Or I call her now, because she lives in Oregon, so I just call her on 
the phone, although she can't talk too much.  
 
Barbara Wright  26:17 
What is she ill with? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  26:19 
Well, she's had a stroke and getting old. She's 10 years older than I am, so she's in her 80s. 
 
Barbara Wright  26:29 
How does it feel losing somebody so close-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  26:32 
Terrible-- 
 
Barbara Wright  26:32 
And also too, you spent so many years with? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  26:34 
So bad. I just wish I could be with her. It's just one of those things.  
 
Barbara Wright  26:40 
Okay, what did you do in Frankfurt? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  26:49 
Same thing, but not quite as much. In fact, that is when most of us got spoiled. We had, as I said, 
been in these old, broken down buildings and under canvas. And until we got in Deauville, we 
had that hotel. So that was nice, because it was stripped. There was nothing in there. And then 
we got to Frankfurt, and they have confiscated these apartments. And they were beautiful 
apartments, and it's called the WAC Circle, is where-- all the WACs there, and they gave us-- we 
had a room each, we had a dresser, we had closets, which we hadn't had in so long, and it was 
just heaven. And then on top of that, they had what they called DPs, displace-- displaced persons. 
They were mostly Polish people that had-- you know, that had been under the Germans. And this 
is the way that our Army gave them something to do, to keep it-- and make a little money. And 
they-- each apartment had one of these girls, and she did all our cleaning, and she polished our 
buttons, and polished our boots, and did all our washing and everything. It was just heaven. And 
it's-- that happened, well, the whole time we were there. But I heard that-- I heard after we left, 
that they did away with that. [Laughs] That didn't go too good with higher-ups, I guess. But they, 
I mean, our officers, what we-- they were doing. 
 
Barbara Wright  28:45 
And were the women's-- Were the women, the only one that received these DPs? 
 
Page 13 of 13 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  28:53 
Yeah. 
 
Barbara Wright  28:55 
Nice. Describe the apartment for me, was there a lot of woodwork-- 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  28:59 
There was three bedrooms. The beds were beautiful. They had these thick-- not kind of-- they're 
mattresses, but they go way down there-- feather, I guess, they're made of feathers or something, 
but you get on that and sink way down, and... I see they-- must have a kitchen? Yeah, they did, 
yeah we did. We had a kitchen. Course, we never used it, because we had to still go and eat in 
the mess hall. But they did-- we did have three? Now, I bet you they were two bedrooms and 
maybe a living room, which was used as a bedroom, that's what it-- I'm sure that's what it must 
have been, because they were regular apartments, and they did have a kitchen. I can't remember 
what kind of-- isn't that sad, that I can't remember what kind of equipment they had there-- it 
could have been stripped, I don't know. I know we didn't cook there anything.  
 
Barbara Wright  30:09 
Approximately how old was the building? Do you think it's built? 
 
Olive Mary Milbourne Carlton  30:16 
I don't think they've been built very long, but they hadn't been damaged. Well, in fact, the whole 
area hadn't been damaged, really, because, as I said, the headquarters hadn't been managed at all, 
and then that-- Baumgarten, it was all in one piece too. 
 
Barbara Wright  30:38 
Okay. Okay, we're going to switch sides now. 